autoroute 10 Autoroute 10 (Bonaventure - portion au nord du canal (boul. urbain))

[IshmaelJones]

 

• Demolir l'autoroute
  
• Conserver la portion entre William et (juste avant) Wellington
  
• Construire le fameux SLR dans l'axe de l'autoroute
  
• Construire la Gare Multimedia SUR cette portion d'autoroute
  
• Utiliser des coquilles d'autobus Rive-Sud comme abris
  
• Restaurer le Haymarket Square entre William et St-Paul
  
• Extension possible de Duke et Nazareth pour traverser le canal et rejoindre Mill
  
• Amenager Duke et Nazareth comme RUES (et non boulevards) urbaines
  
• Projet immobilier signature sur Wellington entre Duke et Nazareth
  
• etc.
  

 

See also Alternatives to the Dalhousie Corridor (griffintown.org)

 

Et le plan du Comite pour le sain redeveloppement de Griffintown pour le quartier.

 

The SLR (light rail) has been the real long-term solution for decades. While many will throw their hands up and say that there's no money, it can't cross a bridge or it's a silly idea, consider the following:

• an SLR link to the base of the Victoria or Champlain bridge is enough to let the buses transfer their passengers earlier without having to fight through an urban environment
  
• the infamous airport train could be headed for Bonaventure, and it has better chances of actually being funded. The SLR and airport train could share some right of way, infrastructure and rolling stock, saving costs.
  
• Bonaventure is a pendulum highway, and has been redundant since the completion of Ville-Marie. An SLR can render it obsolete!
  

 

Imagine chaque jour descendre de ton SLR et marcher sur l'autoroute ou t'etais toujours pogne dans le traffic :

 

 

 

Des solutions alternatives pensées, autant économiquement que socialement et environnementalement logiques, existent. Ce qui n'existe pas c'est la communication entre les palliers du gouvernement, et la volonté de comprendre les enjeux réels qui s'épandent au delà des zones d'études établies. Avoir de la vision, c'est pas seulement produire des beaux documents comme le fait la SHM pour vous convaincre qu'ils savent ce qu'ils font, mais que les informations contenues à l'intérieur des documents soient justes et fiables...ce qui n'est malheureusement pas le cas avec le Quartier Bonaventure, comme ça a été démontré à l'OCPM. Nous pouvons donc, entre citoyens, se décider sur une vision commune qui répond à tous nous besoins, ou à la majorité...et nous avons toujours tous été d'accords qu'il faut changer la face de ce quartier. Oublions donc les insultes aléatoires si nous voulons abouttir à un projet d'envergure qui passera le test du temps. Le status quo actuellement à Montréal est défini par le "court-termisme" que nous subissons depuis que la Bonaventure est construite (en urgence pour l'Expo). Grâce à ce status quo, on est trop habitué à Montréal de construire, démolir, reconstruire, et de redémolir encore et encore...regarder l'état de nos routes et les nids de poules qui finissent jamais et qui ne cessent de revenir quelques semaines après les avoir patchés. Quoi qu'en soit le cas, le status quo est la dernière chose que nous voulons conserver. Une chance qu'il existe des citoyens assez bien informés pour démontrer aux autres que les promotteurs financés par la Ville ne fassent pas nécessairement tous leurs devoirs. Malheureusement, ces demi-mesures sont une raison pour laquelle des projets comme celui du QB sont retardés ainsi.

 

"How do you know so much about everything?' was asked of a very wise and intelligent man; and the answer was 'By never being afraid or ashamed to ask questions as to anything of which I was ignorant."

John Abbott

[Malek]

Imagine chaque jour descendre de ton SLR et marcher sur l'autoroute ou t'etais toujours pogne dans le traffic :

 

 

lol, t'es sérieux? On dirait que tu l'as jamais utilisé.

[OursNoir]

:[...]regarder l'état de nos routes et les nids de poules qui finissent jamais et qui ne cessent de revenir quelques semaines après les avoir patchés. [...]

 

Pas trop trop le choix de juste patcher, quand on veut reconstruire à neuf on se fait dire qu'il faut tout réaménager pour que ce soit à l'échelle humaine, ou bien, pire encore, que le budget devrait être investi en transport en commun.

 

Just bulldoze the damn thing, build a one lane tunnel in each direction from the remaining highway to the 720 and be done with it.

[SKYMTL]

What an idiotic article.

 

Wow. Just wow.

 

I totally agree with it though. It seems like you don't remember how every other project like this (l'Acadie circle, boul. St Laurent, et all) ended in monumental cock-ups. What will make this one different?

 

For some reason people seem to think this will spur on development. Development of what exactly? More low-priced, brown brick condos that won't sell due to their proximity to the train tracks. Surely not these gleaming highrises the renderings love to show since commercial real-estate is obviously not in full-on demand and you know the NIMBYs will have something to say about THAT.

 

The article also brings up an excellent point about the train tracks. They're a scar that cuts across the urban fabric of the city and nothing can be done about them. As I mentioned above, they will definately stunt development on the wester side of this project.

 

Another good point is the cost overruns which can and will be associated with this project. $600 million? Yeah right, once all the usual cronies are paid we'll be lucky to get out of this with a billion spent and a project that sits right up there with the Big Owe when it comes to white elephant status.

 

The way I see it, I am fed up with all this talk we seem to love here in Montreal. There are two options in my books:

 

1: Shut up and build the thing

 

2: Don't do anything and let it crumble

 

Sadly, neither seems to happen here in Quebec. Why? Because construction happens at a snail-like pace or they launch millions of dollars worth of studies BEFORE the structure crumbles only to not have an option ready WHEN it crumbles.

[Cataclaw]

I totally agree with it though. It seems like you don't remember how every other project like this (l'Acadie circle, boul. St Laurent, et all) ended in monumental cock-ups. What will make this one different?

 

For some reason people seem to think this will spur on development. Development of what exactly? More low-priced, brown brick condos that won't sell due to their proximity to the train tracks. Surely not these gleaming highrises the renderings love to show since commercial real-estate is obviously not in full-on demand and you know the NIMBYs will have something to say about THAT.

 

The article also brings up an excellent point about the train tracks. They're a scar that cuts across the urban fabric of the city and nothing can be done about them. As I mentioned above, they will definately stunt development on the wester side of this project.

 

Another good point is the cost overruns which can and will be associated with this project. $600 million? Yeah right, once all the usual cronies are paid we'll be lucky to get out of this with a billion spent and a project that sits right up there with the Big Owe when it comes to white elephant status.

 

The way I see it, I am fed up with all this talk we seem to love here in Montreal. There are two options in my books:

 

1: Shut up and build the thing

 

2: Don't do anything and let it crumble

 

Sadly, neither seems to happen here in Quebec. Why? Because construction happens at a snail-like pace or they launch millions of dollars worth of studies BEFORE the structure crumbles only to not have an option ready WHEN it crumbles.

 

The "Building anything is too expensive" argument:

 

Everything costs money. With that mentality nothing will ever get built, ever.

 

 

The "Train tracks" argument:

 

With that logic, why bother feeding the poor? There will always be more poor to feed.. we can't feed them all. We can't improve the area 100%, we can't remove the tracks, but we can remove the elevated expressway and improve things a heck of a lot! Lots of high density housing exists near train tracks, this will be no different.

[IshmaelJones]

Pas trop trop le choix de juste patcher, quand on veut reconstruire à neuf on se fait dire qu'il faut tout réaménager pour que ce soit à l'échelle humaine, ou bien, pire encore, que le budget devrait être investi en transport en commun.

 

Just bulldoze the damn thing, build a one lane tunnel in each direction from the remaining highway to the 720 and be done with it.

 

Me semble que c't'un phénomène purement Montréalais; ce refus de bien faire un travail du début jusqu'à la fin nous laisse avec des propositions de développements exactement comme nos routes: pleines de trous!

[Cyrus]

With that logic, why bother feeding the poor? There will always be more poor to feed.. we can't feed them all.

 

Damn right! If the bastards are hungry they can go pick berries with the Mexicans in St.Rémi and get paid! (I think this actually happened in an episode of Les Bougon, hilarious)

[Habsfan]

The way I see it, I am fed up with all this talk we seem to love here in Montreal. There are two options in my books:

 

1: Shut up and build the thing

 

2: Don't do anything and let it crumble

 

Sadly, neither seems to happen here in Quebec. Why? Because construction happens at a snail-like pace or they launch millions of dollars worth of studies BEFORE the structure crumbles only to not have an option ready WHEN it crumbles.

 

I completely agree with you! Too many pseudo-intellectuals love to hear the sound of their own voices and love to discuss eternally about a certain project. Before you know it, 7 studies havce been completed and the cost of the project has doubled!!!

[Cataclaw]

Indecisiveness is our greatest flaw.

[nerdboy]

Indecisiveness is our greatest flaw.

 

I would argue that it is a complete lack of leadership. As the people you love to refer to as NIMBYs made clear in all of their communication at the OCPM, the idea of transforming the Bonaventure is great. The execution is poor. Why is the execution poor? It's not because we don't have great talent in this city to design intelligent projects. It's because we don't have leaders who will allow that talent to shine and shield them from the corrupt influences. We could have a great project with popular support moving ahead right now. We don't because of poor leadership from the start.