LNH - Une deuxième équipe à Toronto ?

[MTLskyline]

In my opinion this is how things should go down:

 

Tampa Bay -> Quebec City

New York Islanders -> Toronto, Hamilton or Kitchener

Nashville -> Winnipeg

Anaheim -> Seattle

Columbus -> Portland, Oregon

Florida -> Milwaukee

Atlanta -> Cleveland

 

 

Milwaukee would move to the West, and Detroit would move to the East.

 

New Divisions:

 

EAST

Northeast

Boston

Montreal

Ottawa

Quebec City

Toronto

 

Central

Buffalo

Cleveland

Detroit

Hamilton

Pittsburgh

 

Atlantic

Carolina

New York Rangers

New Jersey

Philadelphia

Washington

 

WEST

Midwest

Chicago

Milwaukee

Minnesota

St. Louis

Winnipeg

 

Northwest

Calgary

Colorado

Edmonton

Seattle

Vancouver

 

Southwest

Dallas

Los Angeles

Phoenix

Portland

San Jose

[Ornello Mastrocola]

Great job MTLSkyline! I like it alot!

[Habsfan]

what bs... they need to get rid of teams in the NHL not add them!

 

It's not an expansion, they would most likely move a struggling team in the southern US to Toronto. The league would still have 30 teams.

 

Je ne crois pas que cette récession frappe le Canada aussi durement qu'elle est en traîn de frapper les USA. Nous seront bien mieux au Canada qu'aux USA et même en période de récession, Toronto pourrait facilement faire vivre une deuxième équipe de la LNH.

 

Des fois je me dis qu'il y a plusieurs Montréalais qui croient que Toronto est juste un peu plus grosse que Montréal, et que Montréal est un aussi gros marché de Hockey que Toronto...et c'est là qu'ils se trompent. Le GTA et le Golden Horseshoe a 7 millions d'habitants, c'est DEUX fois plus que Montréal...et ils ont plus d'argent. Il y a plus de fans de Hockey QUI ONT DE L'ARGENT à Toronto qu'à Montréal. Montréal ne pourrait pas faire vivre deux équipes de la LNH.

 

La Preuve...ça fait 3 ans que les Leafs manquent les séries et qu'ils sont poches, mais le ACC est toujours plein et ils chargent le GROS prix pour les billets. Au début de cette décennie quand le CH était poche, le CH avait ben de la misère à remplir le Centre Bell. Il y avait des soirées où il y avait 2500 et 3000 sièges vides dans le Centre Bell!

 

LE CH est présentement très populaire car ils sont bon, mais si le CH était poche, je vous garatie que les "fairweather fans" ne se présenteraient pas au Centre Bell en aussi gros nombre, tandis qu'à TO, le ACC est toujours plein malgré une équipe horrible!

[Malek]

encore une fois, je ne crois pas être hors sujet. à cet effet, la crise économique qui a déjà commencé au niveau mondial aura de très grandes conséquences sur l'emploi d'ici les prochains mois et prochaines années. Donc, il faut reprendre le contexte mon cher Malek lorsqu'on dit une information. Ainsi, le fait que Toronto (cash city) aimerais avoir une 2e équipes dans la LNH ne se matéralisera pas dû à la crise économique qui frappera l'Occident. Donc, avant de dire a quelqu'un qui est hors sujet, veuillez vous en tenir aux informations !.

 

regarde, arrête de détourner les sujets sur chaque fil, de "bumper" tous les maudits fils parceque t'aime rosemont (on est réellement indifférent) et de dénigrer Toronto (cash city) à chaque texte que tu écris. Les gens ont le droit de pas partager ton opinion, il faut que tu t'y habitues, sinon c'est vraiment pas ta place ici.

[rosey12387]

I have no opposition to it. Chicago has two baseball teams. I also have no issue with any of you being against it. But if you're going to be against the idea, be sure to have more concrete and objective reasons than "I hate Toronto so it must be a bad idea". I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Many of you marginialize Montreal by your often uneven criticism of issues that have to deal with Toronto. It almost looks as though some of your are envious and afraid to show it. Somehow I feel the idea would not be looked at so negatively by some fo you if the word Toronto was replaced by the name of another city that already has a team. I'm not trying to be condescending but am merely trying to say Montreal is a great city by its own right and there is no need to continually look at Toronto as the cause of any of our misfortunes or shortcomings.

[Kovalev]

In my opinion this is how things should go down:

 

Tampa Bay -> Quebec City

New York Islanders -> Toronto, Hamilton or Kitchener

Nashville -> Winnipeg

Anaheim -> Seattle

Columbus -> Portland, Oregon

Florida -> Milwaukee

Atlanta -> Cleveland

 

 

Milwaukee would move to the West, and Detroit would move to the East.

 

New Divisions:

 

EAST

Northeast

Boston

Montreal

Ottawa

Quebec City

Toronto

 

Central

Buffalo

Cleveland

Detroit

Hamilton

Pittsburgh

 

Atlantic

Carolina

New York Rangers

New Jersey

Philadelphia

Washington

 

WEST

Midwest

Chicago

Milwaukee

Minnesota

St. Louis

Winnipeg

 

Northwest

Calgary

Colorado

Edmonton

Seattle

Vancouver

 

Southwest

Dallas

Los Angeles

Phoenix

Portland

San Jose

 

une liste parfaite!

[francely57]

In my opinion this is how things should go down:

 

Tampa Bay -> Quebec City

New York Islanders -> Toronto, Hamilton or Kitchener

Nashville -> Winnipeg

Anaheim -> Seattle

Columbus -> Portland, Oregon

Florida -> Milwaukee

Atlanta -> Cleveland

 

 

Milwaukee would move to the West, and Detroit would move to the East.

 

New Divisions:

 

EAST

Northeast

Boston

Montreal

Ottawa

Quebec City

Toronto

 

Central

Buffalo

Cleveland

Detroit

Hamilton

Pittsburgh

 

Atlantic

Carolina

New York Rangers

New Jersey

Philadelphia

Washington

 

WEST

Midwest

Chicago

Milwaukee

Minnesota

St. Louis

Winnipeg

 

Northwest

Calgary

Colorado

Edmonton

Seattle

Vancouver

 

Southwest

Dallas

Los Angeles

Phoenix

Portland

San Jose

 

Nice! You should send this to the NHL!

 

...just like Cataclaw should send his bridge and metro plans to the MTQ and AMT!

[ErickMontreal]

Big dollars for second T.O. team

 

DAVID SHOALTS

November 10, 2008 at 1:32 AM EST

 

The value of a second NHL team in Toronto would range between $400-million and $600-million, and Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment would be entitled to a one-time territorial payment of up to $250-million for allowing the relocation of an existing team, according to sports economists.

 

The second team in Toronto would instantly become the third most valuable franchise in the league behind the Maple Leafs and New York Rangers and on par with the Detroit Red Wings and Montreal Canadiens, sports finance expert Marc Ganis said.

 

Ganis, the president of SportsCorp Ltd. of Chicago and a consultant to professional sports clubs and leagues, said the size and strength of the Greater Toronto Area market would drive the new franchise's value. The payment to MLSE would range between $90-million and $250-million (all currency U.S.), depending on factors such as arena rental, sponsorship, broadcast rights and advertising.

 

“There is no better [hockey] market anywhere than the one for a second team in Toronto,” Ganis said. “The reason is the strength of the Toronto market for hockey.”

 

Brad Humphreys, a University of Alberta professor who teaches sports economics, said many variables would be considered to calculate the rights fee, particularly whether the team would become a tenant at the MLSE-owned Air Canada Centre. The rights fee would be lower if the team rented the Air Canada Centre and significantly higher if the club operated another arena in the GTA area.

 

Likewise, Ganis said, the team's estimated value would be closer to the bottom range if it rented the Air Canada Centre rather than owning its own arena in, say, North York.

 

“It's tricky because it involves not just current costs but perpetual costs,” Humphreys said. “Who knows? What if 10 years from now the new franchise has won a couple of Stanley Cups and the Leafs have not?”

 

However, Humphreys believes “$200-million would not be an unreasonable figure” as an estimated rights fee to be paid to the Leafs.

 

Some NHL governors have informally discussed the notion of placing a second team in the GTA rather than in Hamilton or another Southern Ontario market.

 

But getting another franchise into Toronto could be difficult – to the point of a prospective owner having to resort to litigation. In that scenario, two legal experts say, there's a good chance the league would be forced into submission.

 

EXPAND OR RELOCATE

 

There would be two ways of landing a second team in Toronto. One would be through expansion, which would be easier as it would involve implicit support from the league and MLSE. It's also the more unlikely option, as NHL commissioner Gary Bettman has repeatedly indicated North American expansion isn't on the agenda. Bettman's strategy instead is to continue supporting dubious warm-climate hockey markets such as Nashville, Atlanta, Florida and Phoenix.

 

The other method is to relocate an existing team and be prepared to fight the NHL for the right to move it.

 

The incumbent owner would ask the NHL for approval to move the team to another city. If the franchise was being sold to a new owner, the league would first conduct due diligence before approving the sale. (The NHL has an uneven record in this area, given the current bankruptcy proceedings involving Nashville Predators minority owner William (Boots) Del Biaggio.)

 

Assuming the new owner was deemed worthy, the governors could approve both the sale and the move. However, if the governors approved the sale and refused the move, or refused the sale because it involved a move to Toronto, the dispute could go to court.

 

Two experts in antitrust law both say there would be at least one and possibly two legal avenues for an owner to pursue.

 

Anita Anand, the associate dean of the University of Toronto's Faculty of Law, said that if the NHL tried to prevent a move, the prospective owner could take the league to court under Section 79 of the Canadian Competition Act.

COMPETITON IN THE COURTS

 

Theoretically, the NHL could not use its “dominant position” in the professional hockey market to prevent competition with an existing company, in this case the Maple Leafs. Anand said a lawsuit could be filed on those grounds even though the Competition Bureau, which acts as an enforcement arm for the federal government in antitrust matters, ruled last March that the NHL does not engage in monopolistic behaviour.

 

The bureau stated that its decision could not be used as the basis for a future case. Therefore, Anand said, “it is possible for the dominant position argument to be successful in a new context.”

 

The Competition Act states that when “one or more persons substantially control . . . a class or species of business,” it is not permissible for those persons to “have the effect of preventing or lessening competition substantially in a market.”

 

Another expert who works in antitrust law for a major downtown Toronto firm said the prospective owner could pursue legal action under the section of the Competition Act that deals with restraint of trade. The lawyer, who did not want to be identified because his firm has had dealings with parties involved with the NHL, said a restraint-of-trade complaint could even involve criminal charges.

 

“You can look at it as if there is an agreement to restrict trade severely,” the lawyer said. “Then, with a league, maybe that agreement lessens competition unduly. That could get you into the criminal provision of the act.”

 

BEEN THERE, DONE THAT

 

The bureau investigated a complaint last year that alleged the league's constitution allowed any of the NHL's 30 teams to veto the move of another team into an 80-kilometre radius of its home arena.

 

The bureau's decision dealt with Jim Balsillie's attempt to buy the Nashville Predators and move the franchise to Hamilton. The NHL blocked the purchase.

 

In its decision, the Competition Bureau said it “found no instance where a ‘veto' was exercised by an incumbent club to protect its local territory from entry by a competing franchise.”

 

NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly affirmed in e-mail to The Globe and Mail that the constitution does not guarantee a veto. “Any [franchise] relocation into Southern Ontario would only require a majority vote of the Board of Governors,” he said.

 

Since the Competition Bureau has already been satisfied no veto exists, Anand said, “it may be difficult for an argument about restraint of trade to succeed.”

 

However, if someone wanted to move a team into Toronto, this would provide the “new context” Anand mentioned, and a different decision would be possible.

 

What could not be disputed, the experts agreed, is the payment of a territorial rights fee. The NHL and other sports leagues have charged the fees in the past. Most recently in the NHL, former Los Angeles Kings owner Bruce McNall received $25-million in 1993 when the league awarded the Walt Disney Co. an expansion franchise in Anaheim.

[ErickMontreal]

Publié le 11 novembre 2008 à 10h57 | Mis à jour à 10h59

 

Deuxième équipe à Toronto: pas dans les plans de Bettman

 

La Presse Canadienne

Toronto

 

Gary Bettman a déclaré lundi que la Ligue nationale de hockey n'envisageait pas établir une deuxième équipe dans la région de Toronto, même si le marché pouvait la faire survivre.

 

C'est ce que rapporte le quotidien torontois The Globe and Mail dans son édition de mardi.

 

«Est-ce que le marché de l'Ontario peut soutenir une autre équipe? Probablement», a lui-même répondu le commissaire de la LNH devant un auditoire venu participer à une conférence sur le sport et les affaires à Toronto.

 

«Mais vous ne pouvez baser une décision en fonction de probabilités. Vous devez analyser le marché avec attention», a aussitôt ajouté Bettman, en insistant sur le fait que ce dossier ne faisait absolument pas partie de l'ordre du jour des réunions des gouverneurs.

 

Bettman a fait remarquer que le transfert dans la région de Toronto d'une concession actuellement en opérations ne se produira pas parce que les 30 formations composant les cadres de la ligue sont viables financièrement. Il a renchéri en précisant qu'il n'y avait pas de projet d'expansion en vue, en raison de «conditions économiques incertaines».

 

Selon Bettman, si un propriétaire, avec l'assentiment des gouverneurs, déterminait que son marché ne pouvait plus faire survivre son équipe et qu'il devait procéder à un transfert, la ligue se pencherait alors sur le dossier.

 

«Si nous en arrivions là, nous étudierions la question. Mais nous n'en sommes pas là», a rappelé le commissaire.

[Habsfan]

J'ai assez hâte que Bettman prenne sa retraite. Ce maudit avocat fait tout son possible pour aider les équipes des marchés des USA, mais ne lève pas le petit doigt pour les équipes Canadiennes!