REM - Matériel Roulant

[champdemars]

Il y a 5 heures, Rocco a dit :

So glad to have proper train/metro cars with the REM. Much more beefy and sturdy. Its so weird to see a tram wagon running on huge dedicated train tracks. Doesnt fit at all.

Le REM est un peu simple en terme de design et il est construit en Inde, mais le fait qu'ils aient pris des trains éprouvés et standards qui roulent déjà dans plusieurs villes va faire en sorte d'avoir moins de problèmes de départ, contrairement à Ottawa.

Il y a 2 heures, Rocco a dit :

And we are the first to have full scale portes pallières in North America. I still can't beleive how retarded mass transit is in North America. 

Bien d'accord avec toi. C'est une occasion manquée pour Ottawa à ce niveau, ils auraient pu avoir une ligne automatisée pour quasiment le même prix.

[Enalung]

6 hours ago, FrodoMTL said:

Because Ottawa's Confederation Line (soon to be "Line 1" as they construct and open lines 2, 3, and 4 in the next few years) was originally designed to be an at-grade line with street crossings, much like a traditional tramway. However, when the design was finally converted to full grade separation, they had already placed the orders for Alstom Citadis LRVs and could not back out of it. Hence, you have this weird combination of a metro-like infrastructure but operated with LRT-style vehicles (not uncommon in many of the new U.S. LRT systems like Seattle). The positive news is that Ottawa Line 1 at least achieves full grade separation, which is not something the Toronto Line 5 Eglinton LRT will get even with $12 billion + sunk into that project...

Just shows the importance of making the "right" decision from the start, because these things could have decades of downstream impact on the future usability of the system. And yes, I'm glad REM-A went with 1) full grade separation 2) full automation 3) metro-style rollingstock.

Ils auraient pu revendre les trains qu'ils ont commandé, ou encore, trouver une autre ville au Canada qui en a de besoin. On a de multiples projets de transport un peu partout au pays qui sont à diverses étapes de conception / construction. Sinon, si nécessaire dans le futur, c'est probablement plus simple d'abaisser la surface de roulement que de reconstruire les stations.

[SameGuy]

The Blue line is still getting its CBTC upgrade by the time the extension opens (nobody makes or services the 70s-era analog ATC system of our metro, and the line can’t run with two distinct ATCs), so it remains to be seen if more Azur will be added to the fleet to service the Blue. If that happens, I expect platform screen doors on the Blue line by the start of the next decade (and possibly GoA2/4 — fully automated, but with a union worker picking his or her nose in the cab). I expect the other lines will eventually get Urbalis (or whatever Alstom does with CityFlo after the merger), perhaps by the end of this decade.

[Rocco]

51 minutes ago, SameGuy said:

The Blue line is still getting its CBTC upgrade by the time the extension opens (nobody makes or services the 70s-era analog ATC system of our metro, and the line can’t run with two distinct ATCs), so it remains to be seen if more Azur will be added to the fleet to service the Blue. If that happens, I expect platform screen doors on the Blue line by the start of the next decade (and possibly GoA2/4 — fully automated, but with a union worker picking his or her nose in the cab). I expect the other lines will eventually get Urbalis (or whatever Alstom does with CityFlo after the merger), perhaps by the end of this decade.

Dont get your hopes too high, its the same old STM after all... Taking more than a decade to renovate 1 station and service a few escalators (jean-talon anyone?) should be a warning sign to any "big projects" to come.

[SameGuy]

The Blue extension won’t happen without upgrading the entire line to CBTC. The upgrade has to be functional before the extension opens in five-six-seven years. But yeah, platform doors project is postponed indefinitely. 

[p_xavier]

Il y a 7 heures, SameGuy a dit :

The Blue line is still getting its CBTC upgrade by the time the extension opens (nobody makes or services the 70s-era analog ATC system of our metro, and the line can’t run with two distinct ATCs), so it remains to be seen if more Azur will be added to the fleet to service the Blue. If that happens, I expect platform screen doors on the Blue line by the start of the next decade (and possibly GoA2/4 — fully automated, but with a union worker picking his or her nose in the cab). I expect the other lines will eventually get Urbalis (or whatever Alstom does with CityFlo after the merger), perhaps by the end of this decade.

Not planned, especially that the Orange Line won't get them, anytime soon. All lines are currently GoA2 as the garages signalling systems were updated. 

Not until the fleet renewal in 2036.

[Enalung]

11 hours ago, Rocco said:

Dont get your hopes too high, its the same old STM after all... Taking more than a decade to renovate 1 station and service a few escalators (jean-talon anyone?) should be a warning sign to any "big projects" to come.

Considering that they only have about 5 hours per night to sneak in materials, do the work, and then get out before the morning rush, it's to be expected that the time schedule is going to be way longer then for your average construction site, but one decade does seem a bit excessive.

[Elv13]

Le 2021-03-02 à 14:07, FrodoMTL a dit :

Hence, you have this weird combination of a metro-like infrastructure but operated with LRT-style vehicles (not uncommon in many of the new U.S. LRT systems like Seattle).

I live in Seattle right now (lets see what happens once Covid is gone, but stuck here for now) and Seattle mass transit makes no sense. It is fully oriented toward park and ride. There is no Subway and the current LRT services nowhere useful unless you work at the airport. Compared to the REM, they made every single bad decisions one could make. Most stations are either in industrial parks, under homeless people tent cities or near bungalows. It services nothing useful and is always empty.

The line lines under construction service Microsoft/Nintendo headquarter and follow 2 highways. That's actually kind of better since it has actually somewhere to go. The other line will eventually (2036, lol) follow another highway and reach Boeing Everett factory.  All this time, downtown will still be deadlocked (if people ever get back to work, downtown is a very unsafe homeless tent city right now, nothing people in MTL can imagine exist in North America).

Point is, LRT are sometime not "by design" and are just the result of under investment. The LRT exists to serve a business need (bypass the traffic jams between airport and downtown) rather than be a useful public transport. Seattle citizens ballot-vetoed to /block/ a subway being built in the 70's. The federal government would have paid most of the bills, so it was just Nimbysm.

[FrodoMTL]

7 hours ago, Elv13 said:

I live in Seattle right now (lets see what happens once Covid is gone, but stuck here for now) and Seattle mass transit makes no sense. It is fully oriented toward park and ride. There is no Subway and the current LRT services nowhere useful unless you work at the airport. Compared to the REM, they made every single bad decisions one could make. Most stations are either in industrial parks, under homeless people tent cities or near bungalows. It services nothing useful and is always empty.

The line lines under construction service Microsoft/Nintendo headquarter and follow 2 highways. That's actually kind of better since it has actually somewhere to go. The other line will eventually (2036, lol) follow another highway and reach Boeing Everett factory.  All this time, downtown will still be deadlocked (if people ever get back to work, downtown is a very unsafe homeless tent city right now, nothing people in MTL can imagine exist in North America).

Point is, LRT are sometime not "by design" and are just the result of under investment. The LRT exists to serve a business need (bypass the traffic jams between airport and downtown) rather than be a useful public transport. Seattle citizens ballot-vetoed to /block/ a subway being built in the 70's. The federal government would have paid most of the bills, so it was just Nimbysm.

In many U.S. cities, the newer LRT/Streetcar projects are less transportation, and more used as "urban revitalization" projects that cities fund in order to attract real estate developers along the streetcar routes, with their primary purpose being to "revitalize" (aka gentrify) their downtown areas - e.g. Detroit Q Line, Atlanta/DC Streetcars, etc. - they serve no functional purpose as a viable transportation tool (since many of them operate as a downtown "circulator" with one-way service). As far as I know, projects like the above would never fly in Canadian cities. Even a "private" investor like CDPQi would never propose something as ludicrous as the DC Streetcar or Detroit QLine. Seattle's LRT lines are actually not too bad compared to the other newer streetcar lines in the U.S., but noticeably worse than Canadian counterparts like Calgary LRT or Toronto TTC Streetcar network which get far far higher ridership.

Detroit QLine:

Modifié 8 mars 2021 par FrodoMTL

[Gaston]

it is true that the DC streetcar is beyond ridiculous!