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Des patrons unilingues anglais à la Caisse de dépôt


Habsfan

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As an Anglo who moved here from ROC I would be embarrassed if I couldn't speak French after 11 years! I've been here 4 years and can speak, read and understand French (writing is another thing- la grammaire- back to school for that!) and I wouldn't have dreamed of moving here without learning.

 

It's entirely reasonable to expect the head of human resources (!) of CDP to be able to communicate with the majority of his employees- he would not get a position such as that anywhere else in the non English-speaking world, why should he here? He certainly wouldn't get a job anywhere else in North America without learning English, his CV would go straight to the recycling.

 

Have some respect, Mr. Smith.

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Membres prolifiques

The point is, if there's a compelling reason to make money in Quebec, even people from Toronto will invest here. Instead of whining and bitching and being paranoid about ROC trying to assimilate us into a backwater colony, why don't we be pro-active and try to compete? Heck, even the ubisoft CEO is saying that there isn't great talent left in Montreal vs. Toronto - and he's French.

 

I'm pretty sure he was referring to the talent pool. There is a shortage of people in the gaming industry. Please clarify your quote because I don't believe for a second he meant what you think he said. Speaking of Ubisoft, I started playing their latest game (Assassin's creed) and it was almost entirely programmed in Montreal.

 

Quebec companies can hire the best people from all over the world but if you are put in a position of authority, I find it disrespectful if you don't try to improve your knowledge of the language majority. Do you find it fair that middle-class workers not understand the language of their better-paid superiors? Imagine what that does for your morale?

 

On a personal note, I find it completly unacceptable for a under 30 year old montreal-born person not be able to function in both english and french. There is no excuse in my book.

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Freaking spelling mistakes!
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The point is, if there's a compelling reason to make money in Quebec, even people from Toronto will invest here.

The may even want to build a tall building across from Centre Bell. You never know.

 

Instead of whining and bitching and being paranoid about ROC trying to assimilate us into a backwater colony,

Some would argue that ROC has already been assimilated into a backwater colony of the U.S. Becoming a backwater within a backwater isn't a particularly compelling notion.

 

why don't we be pro-active and try to compete? Heck, even the ubisoft CEO is saying that there isn't great talent left in Montreal vs. Toronto - and he's French.

I think you have it backwards. Québec was pro-active regarding the video industry, Toronto and ROC are trying to play catch up- 15 years after the fact.

 

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http://www.theesa.ca/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/SECOR_ESAC_report_eng_2011.pdf

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The point is, if there's a compelling reason to make money in Quebec, even people from Toronto will invest here. Instead of whining and bitching and being paranoid about ROC trying to assimilate us into a backwater colony, why don't we be pro-active and try to compete? Heck, even the ubisoft CEO is saying that there isn't great talent left in Montreal vs. Toronto - and he's French.

 

 

mark_ac, the problem with your assessment of the Caisse conundrum is that you see it as a business impediment which is to say, you relate the need for everybody to bow down to the english language as the be all-end all.

 

In Toronto, the problem of a lingua franca does not exist, it seems that if a chinese immigrant is hired as a high level manager, he can speak mandarin and not have to speak english to his subordinates, dig?

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mark_ac, the problem with your assessment of the Caisse conundrum is that you see it as a business impediment which is to say, you relate the need for everybody to bow down to the english language as the be all-end all.

 

In Toronto, the problem of a lingua franca does not exist, it seems that if a chinese immigrant is hired as a high level manager, he can speak mandarin and not have to speak english to his subordinates, dig?

 

I think the problem is typical Quebec identity politics that turns everything to BS. The Caisse hired these two guys who deal 99% with assets of the Caisse outside of Quebec. They speak French but poorly, despite attending "learning" sessions, so when in meetings they often go in English because in Montreal almost any educated person is fluently bilingual. I can't see how this is a problem, unless a number of the other people in the meetings don't speak English, which would be inefficient.

 

The issue at hand is this strange perception that English here is a foreign language. Canada is officially bilingual, and Montreal is a city that truly is bilingual. What is the difference between one and the other? The debate is childish and passé, and it is only being brought to light to score political points with xenophobes.

 

when did working for CDP become the exclusive domain of francophones along with virtually all provincial government jobs?

 

Circa 1972. I've only heard of one anglophone government employee, a British immigrant that worked for the MTQ in a low level professional position.

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I think the problem is typical Quebec identity politics that turns everything to BS. The Caisse hired these two guys who deal 99% with assets of the Caisse outside of Quebec. They speak French but poorly, despite attending "learning" sessions, so when in meetings they often go in English because in Montreal almost any educated person is fluently bilingual. I can't see how this is a problem, unless a number of the other people in the meetings don't speak English, which would be inefficient.

 

The issue at hand is this strange perception that English here is a foreign language. Canada is officially bilingual, and Montreal is a city that truly is bilingual. What is the difference between one and the other? The debate is childish and passé, and it is only being brought to light to score political points with xenophobes.

 

 

 

Circa 1972. I've only heard of one anglophone government employee, a British immigrant that worked for the MTQ in a low level professional position.

 

 

I am not against the bilingual status of the city, I rather welcome it. I think that if there is one thing that sets us apart is the fact that business is conducted in two languages and that this strength is one to be upholded and promoted. The english cultural contributions to this city need to be brought to the fore and elevated because there was a period of nationalist discontent that devalued the historical importance of english Montreal. There was harm done on both sides, there is no question about that.

 

The problem is not one that will go away even though you wish it to Cyrus.

 

There are folks in the maritimes or out west who are just as upset stepping on a train or a plane and being spoken to in french by an attendant. It is visceral this reaction to french for some folks. Maybe the mr Smith in question has some of that residual disdain for the people that hinders his ability to engage someone in french. Seriously, he should just learn to speak the language and get on with the business at hand...

 

If anything, Montreal's salvation is the unique mix that makes it infuriatingly hard to navigate at times. The tolerance is high because it is the result of an old cohabitation. We lost a lot of opportunities to a less deserving, blander and altogether less "Open City" in the seventies when law 101 was enacted. The price to pay was high. I remember my first trip to Toronto in the early eighties, and how energetic it was and how much pride Torontonians had in their booming city. Sun Life Assurance had quit Montreal and built a gold inlaid glass skyscraper, and a number of banks had left, and several corporate HQ's in tow. The problem is that the cultural divide was too strong, it was not just the threat of separatism, it was the idea of imposing french (ramming it down their throats) to english speakers who had neglected more or less the history and customs of their french speaking counterparts. There are many people who dont bother driving east of Papineau in this city because it requires an effort. Likewise, there are folks who despise looking at life west of Aylmer street. I embrace all of it.

I only wish more folks would.

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Le problème est simple : les Québécois d'origine française et plus spécifiquement ceux qui sont issues de la colonisation française (autant dire la majorité de la population du Québec, en faisant peut-être exception de Montréal) se sentent à juste titre menacés d'instinction et chaque cri du coeur (car c'est de cela dont il s'agit ici) en est la manifestation.

 

Jamais je n'aurais cru être obligé d'en arriver à cette triste conclusion mais en lisant les commentaires de nos forumeurs anglophones, j'en conclue un profonde incompréhension du fait et de la réalité francophone du Québec et en particulier à Montréal. J'en arrive même à percevoir certe un peu de mépris mais surtout une analyse aveuglée par je ne sais quelle incapacité à se mettre dans la peau des autres. Vous êtes en majorité dans le pays, sur le continent et bien qu'aucun d'entre vous osera l'avouer vos propos sont teintés d'attitude impérialiste.

 

Le fond du problème est simple mais si vous n'êtes pas capables de comprendre ce principe-là, la discussion ne peut plus continuer : ces gars-là ne parlent pas le français qui est la langue de la majorité des employés de cet organisme du gouvernement du Québec, dans une province à majorité francophone. C'est la culture du groupe dominant qui devrait imposer la langue de travail à l'interne et non pas le contraire. Vous imaginez un Québécois qui serait le meilleur candidat pour un poste de haute direction d'une banque de Bay Street mais qui serait unilingue francophone ?! Vous croyez qu'il aurait l'emploi ? Il serait rejeté du revers de la main sans discussion !!!!!! et ce serait absolument compréhensible !!!

 

Bien sûr il faut des accommodements : c'est pour cela que n'importe quel anglophone qui vit à Montréal devrait bénéficier d'un temps "raisonnable" pour apprendre notre langue. Je crois qu'après 11 ans, on a largement dépassé la raison !!

 

De plus, aucun anglophone parmi vous n'a probablement songé à cela (et si vous l'avez fait c'est sans doute au mieux sans état d'âme et au pire avec une certaine satisfaction) mais pour ma part ce qui me désole dans tout ce dossier c'est que ce fait d'actualité nous démontre encore une fois qu'il est très possible de vivre bien et confortablement à Montréal sans connaître la langue de Molière.

 

C'est le noeud du problème !!

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.... mais pour ma part ce qui me désole dans tout ce dossier c'est que ce fait d'actualité nous démontre encore une fois qu'il est très possible de vivre bien et confortablement à Montréal sans connaître la langue de Molière.

 

C'est le noeud du problème !!

 

Je suis entièrement d"accord avec ce que tu dis mais j'apporterais une nuance surtout sur ta dernière phrase. Il est vrai qu'il est encore possible de vivre confortablement à Montréal sans parler français. C'est à la fois un problème mais aussi une sorte de fierté !!! Et oui, une sorte de fierté parce que quoi qu'en dise nos amis du ROC, cela démontre que les québécois sont très très très tolérant et ouvert. Je ne crois pas que cela serait possible ailleurs. Et que des chinois, anglophones, grecs ou hindous puissent vivre parmi nous sans parler notre langue ne me choquent plus. Je crois que Montréal est une ville maintenant assez ''grande'' pour absorber tout ce genre de monde. Autant ceux qui s'intègrent bien (la majorité) que ceux qui ne désirent meme pas s'intégrer. Autrement dit, il y a de la place pour tout le monde.

 

Mais lorsqu'il s'agit d'un poste important d'une institution majeure, alors je suis d'accord que le français devrait etre une priorité à moins d'etre en contact qu'avec des gens de l'extérieur.

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